In this podcast, Noz Urbina will discuss the importance of exceptional omnichannel customer experiences. Noz will share techniques to help your business achieve a great omnichannel customer experience.

Noz Urbina has years of experience in omnichannel architecture and design, and he’ll be discussing how his experiences have helped him design exceptional customer experiences. If you want to improve your omnichannel customer experience, this is the video for you!

Salesforce Posse Podcast often features interviews with thought leaders or significant Salesforce ecosystem members. Yet, in this episode, we interview someone less involved in the Salesforce ecosystem. Noz Urbina, the founder of Urbina Consulting and OmnichannelX, joins today’s conversation to share his knowledge and expertise on omnichannel customer experiences. We begin with understanding what omnichannel is. Noz elaborates on the application of personalization and customer-centricity to omnichannel. He explains that omnichannel personalization is a method for pre-digesting content and making it easier for the user to ingest. In addition, we explore the omnichannel customer experience, detailing how this experience is tailored based on the customer’s location and segmentation. Besides that, Noz outlines the questions an architect should ask to determine if a company is truly implementing omnichannel or merely installing multichannel under the guise of omnichannel.

Noz Urbina is a globally recognised leader in the field of content strategy and customer experience. He’s well known as a pioneer in customer journey mapping and adaptive content modelling for delivering personalised, contextually relevant content experiences in an omnichannel environment. Noz is co-founder and Programme Director of OmnichannelX. He is also co-author of the book “Content Strategy: Connecting the dots between business, brand, and benefits” and lecturer in the Masters Programme in content strategy at the University of Applied Sciences, Graz.

Noz’s company, Urbina Consulting, works with the world’s largest organisations and most complex content challenges. He has assisted dozens of multinational organisations with developing or improving their content strategies, managing tool selections, pilot projects, delivering training, and guiding implementations. Clients include Johnson Pharmaceuticals & Johnson, Microsoft, Sanofi Vaccines, Mastercard, Barclays Bank, Abbott Laboratories, and many more.

[09:37] Omnichannel – What is omnichannel, and how does it work?
[16:12] Personalization – Noz adds that omnichannel personalization involves breaking down content into the right pieces and delivering them to the customer at the most relevant time.
[22:58] Customer Centricity – Difference between multichannel and omnichannel.
[24:43] – OmnichannelX has changed its approach from holding paid in person events yearly to hosting webinars, podcasts, and other learning materials more frequently.
[28:15] Architect’s Role – How does omnichannel relate to the role of an architect?
[30:43] Customer Experience – We explore what the omnichannel consumer experience entails. Also, we further elaborate on how it is tailored based on the customer’s location and segmentation.
[37:34] Data Integration – Determine how unstructured data is processed or labeled, whether it is offloaded or performed on the platform, and how the process is integrated with system components.
[39:43] Advice to Younger Self – What would Noz tell himself If he could go back in time?

Connect with Noz:


Sponsored by Salesforce Architect Training
The Salesforce AppExchange is a marketplace for cloud-based applications that can be used with Salesforce’s customer relationship management (CRM) software. No matter where you are on your Salesforce journey, you’ll have access to tried-and-tested apps, that will help you tackle your particular business challenges and speed up your digital transformation. Luca Benini, COO and co-founder at Nativevideo a Salesforce AppExchange Partner and features in today’s episode of the Salesforce Posse podcast to share his incredible experience at Salesforce.
Luca has been in the Salesforce ecosystem for many years and was MD of Europe for Buddy Media, a social media tool that Salesforce acquired in 2012.
Today, we started the conversation by discussing how Luca got into the Salesforce ecosystem and the world of App Exchange apps. We delve into the many types of Salesforce App Exchange apps, the creation process at a high level, the various ways you may monetize your app, and the best practices for making a successful app. Furthermore, Luca elaborates on why he enjoys participating in Demo Jams. Also, we discuss our favourite audiobooks, and Luca shares some words of wisdom he would give his younger self if he could travel back in time.


Connect with Luca:
Audiobooks we talk about:

When thinking of a Salesforce Architect, people usually jump to the need for a deep technical knowledge of Salesforce. But that’s only part of the picture, and there are so many other skills that are important to become a highly successful Salesforce Architect. Keir Bowden, Chief Technical Officer at BrightGen, features in today’s episode of the Salesforce Posse podcast to share his incredible experience at Salesforce.

Today, we talk to Keir Bowden about the value of people skills, how to handle difficult situations, and the significance of effective communication across organizational levels. We discuss the need to make things as easy to use as possible and the design principles behind this philosophy.  Also, Keir explains critical things you need to know and where to begin your training to become an architect. At last, we reach a point in the conversation where we talk about learning to say no.

Keir has worked in the information technology sector for the past three decades and is currently the Chief Technology Officer at BrightGen, a Salesforce Platinum Partner in the United Kingdom. He is responsible for the current and future technical strategy, certification and product development there. Since 2008, Keir has been developing solutions and applications on Salesforce, and Keir currently possesses a number of qualifications, including the highly sought-after Technical Architect (CTA) certification. In addition to being a Salesforce MVP, he is the author of the Visualforce Development Cookbook, a frequent blogger on topics related to Apex and Visualforce solutions, and a speaker at events such as the Salesforce World Tour, Dreamforce and London’s Calling. He maintains a blog in his leisure time, writing on Apex, Lightning Components, and the Salesforce Command Line Interface.

[02:08] Background – Who is Mr. Big Bob Buzzard?

[04:00] Soft Skills – We are all savvy with PCs, but dealing with actual humans is a different story.

[09:27] Keir’s Role – Keir shares his role and objectives in the room.

[11:46] Be Simple – We discuss the importance of simplicity in design and how to achieve it.

[15:04] Difficult Conversations – Disagreement is typical at times of transition. Keir shares his ideas on how to cope with crises like these.

[20:56] Communication – The importance of communicating at different company levels.

[24:08] Key Learnings – Keir outlines the essential skills you need to become an architect and where to start learning.

[33:54] No – The art of saying “No.”



Hosted by

A clear vision leads to understanding what an organization wants to achieve as a business. Gemma Blezard joined us today to discuss aligning salesforce architecture to organizational vision.

Gemma Blezard is the founder of The Architect Club & Ladies Be Architects. She is also a Salesforce MVP, entrepreneur, and an influencer of Salesforce architects around the world. She has talked at Salesforce and community-led conferences, including user groups, Dreamforce, Salesforce World Tour London, the Salesforce Partner Forum, French Touch Dreamin’, and many more. She has won several awards, including Salesforce’s Golden Hoodie (May 2018), WeAreTheCity’s TechWoman100 award (2018), Salesforce MVP, BIMA100 Digital Champion for Change & Computing’s ENT Role Model of the Year. In 2020, she delivered a free online salesforce training course for the unemployed and won the Digital Revolution award for Outstanding Contribution to the Salesforce ecosystem. Gemma lives in Bedford, England, United Kingdom.

During today’s conversation, Francis and Gemma discussed governance in a salesforce project, following into what empathy can do for others. Gemma shares information about building a vision for her community, The architect club. Further into the conversation, they talk about the relationships between the client and the organization, how they manage risks, and the difference between a developer and architecture. Gemma shares what it is to be a part of a community with her and her journey through years with Salesforce. Wrapping up today’s conversation, Gemma shares what advice she wants to give to her 20 years old self and why.

[02.47] Governance – Starting the conversation, Gemma explains what governance means in a salesforce project.

[07.05] Empathy –  Gemma shares the importance of having empathy towards other people because it helps them to perform better.

[09.03] The architect club – A clear vision is a must in any organization. Gemma dives into how they take considerable time to build their vision first and then go to the others.

[13.39] Relationships – Gemma dives into customer relationships’ role in an organization’s well-being.

[19.51] Readiness – Gemma addresses ‘readiness’ as one of the most significant issues in salesforce projects.

[24.52] Open-ended questions – Gemma shares what questions are better when conversing with your clients.

[32.18] Managing risks – Managing risks is vital. Gemma shares how they manage risks and the part architecture has to play in that situation.

[39.53] Developer vs. architecture – Francis and Gemma shares opinions about the difference between an admin or a developer and architecture.

[45.00] Working with Salesforce – Gemma shares how she joined Salesforce and her journey through the years.

[49.09] Salesforce community – A community gives a sense of belonging to anyone. Gemma talks about what it is like to be a part of the salesforce community.

[55.06] Words of wisdom – Gemma shares a piece of advice for her 20 years old self.


Connect with Gemma
LinkedIn –
Twitter –
Website (Personal) –

Sponsored by Admin To Architect Salesforce Training

As the Salesforce ecosystem expands and integrates with global business technologies, the salesforce DevOps has significantly matured and grown since it started. In today’s episode of the Salesforce Posse Podcast, we are joined by Vernon Keenan to talk about the Salesforce DevOps Ecosystem and the importance of Value Stream Management.

Vernon Keenan is a Senior Industry Analyst at He is an industry analyst and technologist entrepreneur who has founded businesses that use cutting-edge technology to serve customers. He is an internationally renowned Internet commerce sector analyst and thought leader. He was a pioneer in the study of how e-commerce affected the US economy. With original content and thought leadership intended to advance Salesforce app development at all levels, Vernon Keenan fills the gap between targeted market research and inspirational content. He aims to increase prospects and exposure for each participant in the Salesforce DevOps market.

During today’s conversation, we dive into the current state of DevOps in the salesforce ecosystem and what value stream mapping is. Furthermore, we discuss application lifecycle management and wrapping up the conversation, Vernon shares some sites to learn more about Salesforce DevOps.

[00.57] State of DevOps – Starting the conversation, Vernon dives into the current state of DevOps in the salesforce ecosystem along with the key difference between developing systems based on salesforce and other SAS systems.

[07.23] Value Stream Mapping – Vernon defines value stream mapping and what it is trying to do.

[13.31] The platform – Vernon talks about where DevOps stand in the ecosystem, saying it’s not a tool but a platform.

[18.55] Application lifecycle management – Application lifecycle management (ALM) is an integrated system of people, tools, and processes that manages software applications development, testing, maintenance, decommissioning, and retirement.

[22.06] Learning more – Vernon mentions some sites to discover more about Salesforce DevOps as well as a free learning resource for learning more.


Connect with Vernon

LinkedIn –
Website –
Twitter –

Sponsored by Salesforce Training


The Salesforce Architect Group in London is a local resource that enables Salesforce architects, administrators, and developers to learn about Salesforce features and partners and network with one another. Francis Pindar, Tom Bassett and Sam Wadhwan have kicked off the new community group in London and we talk about why we started it all off and what we want the community to get out of it.

Tom currently works for Trigg Digital as a Solution Architect. He has over five years of experience working with the Salesforce platform and is also a Salesforce application/solution architect. Tom’s goal is for customers to get the most out of the CRM, maximise their return on investment, and benefit from working with him. Also, he helps to disseminate the Ohana culture by giving the broader Salesforce Community support in the form of new feature ideas and responses to questions that have been posted. On the other hand, Sam is a Salesforce-certified technical architect and the Chief Technical Architect at PwC.

During our discussion today, Sam and Tom shared their professional backgrounds and the path that led them to become a part of the Salesforce ecosystem for the first time. In addition, we discuss the widespread misperceptions surrounding architects and their work and the numerous campaigns and initiatives undertaken in recent years to dispel these misconceptions. Also, we talk about how the work of an architect needs a great degree of imagination and how important it is to explain a complicated notion in a way that is easy to understand as an architect. Moreover, Sam and Tom share what they are looking forward to experiencing in the community group, in which they highlight that it is impossible to be an expert in everything, and we must narrow our focus to our areas of expertise. Furthermore, they state that they are looking forward to the community group since they believe it will aid the architect community in London and those individuals who aspire to become Salesforce Architects.

[02:20] Background – Introducing Sam and Tom.

[05:24] Architect Group, London – Sam and Tom mention the motivations behind their aspiration to become leaders of the London-based architect group.

[06:42] An Architect –  There is a stigma associated with architects and their work. In recent years, there have been numerous efforts and endeavors to refute these falsehoods.

[09:43] Creativity – We discuss how the work of an architect requires a significant amount of creativity.

[16.01] Communication –  The ability to convey a complex idea in an understandable manner is akin to an art form.

[18:18] Community – Sam and Tom express what they are looking forward to experiencing in the community group.

[20:23] Individual Contribution –  It is impossible to be an expert in everything. You must rely on others and narrow your focus to your areas of expertise.


Connect with Sam and Tom:



Tom Bassett:

Sam Wadhwani:


Mentioned in the episode:

Architect Group, London, UK

Register for Meetings/Events here:

As time passes, organisations that are using salesforce have become more and more dependent on it. Salesforce DevOps is focused on ensuring administrators and developers can release updates and go through the software development lifecycle as efficiently as possible, with the least defects and user interruption. Jack McCurdy, Salesforce DevOps Advocate at Gearset, features in today’s episode of the Salesforce Posse podcast to share his experience as a salesforce advocate.

Jack shares knowledge of DevOps throughout the salesforce ecosystem. He has spent the last few years working with businesses to establish DevOps teams and procedures, which are essential for delivering Salesforce installs successfully and fostering both business growth and customer satisfaction. His passion is supporting the creation and maintenance of outstanding cultures that serve as the pillars of DevOps best practices.

During today’s conversation, we explore what DevOps is, what it provides people, and Jack’s experience working at DevOps. Jack dives into what common problems people want DevOps to find solutions to and how they make it simpler and errorless. Furthermore, he discusses the importance of metrics when measuring success and maturity, and wrapping up the conversation, Jack dives into how communication can solve problems and make a better workplace for employees.

At Salesforce Posse, we interview influencers in the Salesforce ecosystem so that we can gain a better understanding of how to excel in a career path from a Salesforce Admin or Developer to an Architect.

[04.44] DevOps – DevOps is a set of practices combined with software development and IT operations. Starting the conversation, Jack dives into what DevOps is and how they help people to identify problems sooner and solve them.

[06.10] Problems – Jack dives into the common problems people come to DevOps for solutions.

[13.14] Backups – Having backups and the mental health benefits of DevOps. Jack dives into how Dora metrics are used in DevOps.

[15.58] Metrics – Jack explains how essential metrics are when measuring success or maturity.

[21.33] The phoenix project – A Novel about IT, DevOps, and Helping Your Business Win by Gene Kim.

[22.42] Mindset shift – Role changes can be difficult in the beginning. But, with the right communication, you can change the environment for employees and build a level of maturity in the organization.


Sponsored by


Francis Pindar (A2A)  00:00

Hello, my name is Francis Pindar and you are watching or listening to the Salesforce posse podcast. Now, I did catch up with somebody who grabbed me that I was chatting to. And he didn’t realize you could watch this podcast from Spotify. So if you are listening to this on Spotify, bring up your phone or your computer, and you’ll be able to see me in Technicolor. So the Salesforce posse podcast is where I speak with Salesforce industry influencers to gain a better understanding of how to excel in a career path from a Salesforce admin or developer to an architect. And a couple of weeks ago, I was invited to speak at DevOps dreaming, an event dedicated to learning more about Salesforce DevOps, so that we can deliver Salesforce changes more efficiently into production, monitor and learn from those challenges so we can improve the experience of our users and teams implementing on Salesforce. So I did a talk on my Salesforce DevOps journey, but I managed to grab some time with Jack McCurdy, who is performed gearset and is sponsoring this Salesforce streaming event. So if you’re interested in learning more about Salesforce, DevOps, or even have no idea what I’m talking about, when I say DevOps, then I think you’re gonna get a lot of value from this conversation with Jack McCurdy. So without further ado, let’s go. So I am here with Jack. And we’re here at DevOps, dreaming in London learning all about Salesforce DevOps, a maturing model of how you can kind of be more efficient as the way you do stuff in Salesforce. And you are the DevOps guru. That’s why

Jack McCardy  01:49

we had a conversation earlier about yours.

Francis Pindar (A2A)  01:55

Yeah, we did a panel. The panel discussion? I

Jack McCardy  01:58

think it was yeah, it was part of the panel. Yeah, yeah, we

Francis Pindar (A2A)  02:01

did a panel discussion, which was at was really great actually burn out in a tech and it said, yeah, there are no Salesforce gurus. No, it does not exist. The platform is just too big. And you don’t want that pressure. You don’t? Yeah, it’s a really good session. And so how’s it been? So far? Actually?

Jack McCardy  02:20

Yeah, the conference has been amazing. At gearset. Like, we’re really proud and privileged to be members as communities. So it’s great to be able to put this on and do that for them. And, you know, we take great inspiration from things like London’s calling, and all the other community conferences that we get to go to around States and in Europe, and to see that come out here as well and have it be so well attended. And London is really nice to see. And the speakers have all been amazing. So far, we’re only halfway through. But everybody’s had well attended sessions really engaged. And it has prompted some good conversation from what I’ve heard.

Francis Pindar (A2A)  02:54

Yeah. And that’s been quite interesting. Because that even like, you always get kind of stuck in the tech a bit, I think, and just kind of stepping back and kind of going well, I actually, you know, there’s other stuff. There’s the kind of the mental well being piece of DevOps around well, actually, I want to get this stuff into production quicker. From my own well being of seeing I’ve succeeded in stuff and things like that, which I kind of didn’t even really think of, I suppose. Yeah,

Jack McCardy  03:20

for sure. I think that’s one of the big DevOps can play such a big part in, in that you know, mental well being as well as we’ve all been there and late nights because of a change set or failed deployments or and you know, wrestling until 123 Am isn’t an uncommon story that we’ve heard. So finding a way to address that and help people go back to their families or be able to do their hobbies in the evening or what have you plays into that too, as well as that gratification when you see the deployment succeeded. Deployment succeeded button, the fish completes.

Francis Pindar (A2A)  03:53

So okay, so if you are if somebody is coming in this completely new and has no idea what we’re talking about, when we talk about DevOps, what would you say DevOps is? So

Jack McCardy  04:04

DevOps, when you distill it all down to the basics is really to really succinctly it’s the better way of delivering software is ultimately what it comes down to a set of practices and principles that allow for efficient, streamlined delivery. And the word itself is a combination of software development, IT operations, so was taking the best practices from both of those things, and combining it to software delivery team or Salesforce delivery team that’s really firing on all cylinders and can focus on doing the impactful work, the building of features and the user stories or

Francis Pindar (A2A)  04:40

trying to repackage for the 40th time fourth that thing into production.

Jack McCardy  04:46

Absolutely. So it’s all about speeding that process up but doing it in a safe and safe and controlled way. You know, things break. Even in a great DevOps process. Things still break that still happens, but a great DevOps process will help you identify those things sooner and hopefully be easier to resolve if it’s being done. Right. So that’s it in its simplest form, I guess. So okay,

Francis Pindar (A2A)  05:06

so what are the kind of common things that you see people call on problems they’re trying to fix using DevOps.

Jack McCardy  05:12

So a lot of what it comes down to is the pain that people experience when they have a lot of manual steps, there’s, there’s a large percentage of teams that we see have issues when it comes down to things that either have to be, you know, recreated manually in other environments, you know, you you see, to do something in sandbox. And then so many times you hear, let’s recreate it in production manually again, and you know,

Francis Pindar (A2A)  05:37

it’s like a vicious circle that I’ve been at. It’s like the deployment failed. And you know, this is hard, so they will do it manually next time. And so then your manual worksheet and steps grows and gets bigger and bigger, because always scared doing that, you know, anything other than manual.

Jack McCardy  05:53

Exactly. So either manual steps, which are tedious, even if you’re not manually recreating things in production, you’re then creating a change set or creating a package, which then needs to be redeployed to other places, you have folks that are looking to to not have speaking of lists. Actually, if you think about all the message changes that you make when you’re building something, how easy is it to forget one of those things? And by implementing a process tooling, or what have you, it’s about finding ways that you can make that process simpler and easier and less prone to errors that don’t really need to be

Francis Pindar (A2A)  06:24

Yeah, I think I did a talk earlier on. And it’s like, one of those classic problems is that, you know, developers pull out that profile meta data, but not all the fields and then you miss the field field level security in the profile, you push the profiles back, now you’ve overwritten it in your source code control. That’s right. But then you try and deploy it and the deployments fine. Just didn’t include it. Yeah. But it’s actually you know, you’ve got usability issues, because you just can’t access those fields anymore.

Jack McCardy  06:50

For sure. So and then I think if you think about those, those things, and what we’re actually talking about is actually saving people a lot of time and effort is ultimately what it comes down to is the biggest number one reason people people come to us and say, we need to do something about this is because it’s taking the 9, 10, 11, 12 hours a day, you know, for one production deployment. And they might be doing that once a week or two weeks, or if they had a long running project, then we’re talking days worth of deployment time, so literally days worth. So that’s really what it comes down to, there’s

Francis Pindar (A2A)  07:23

actually we were just talking actually, before the podcast, it’s like, do I do edit my own podcast now. And it’s like I used to do and I don’t anymore. And it was a bit of that it’s the same kind of thing where it’s like, well, it’s not what I’m good at, I’m good at the you know, in Salesforce world, doing the configuration, doing the coding, do the building, not packaging, and trying to get it into the next environment, you know, give that to some other tool or practice or a way of working, that makes everything more efficient. And also, it’s more enjoyable, because you’re doing the stuff you love, rather than trying to hack around with change sets, or whatever it is.

Jack McCardy  07:54

That’s it, we’re chatting a little a little bit earlier on about that enjoyment. And that fulfillment, it’s not just a ticket, the green light, it’s just, if I’m not doing that, then I am doing something I’m learning something new, maybe on trailhead, or what have you, I’ve got to build a new feature that I’ve not done before I can actually focus on that not worry about business as usual stuff that gets in the way. And a lot of the time that those things do get in the way, and can either either hunt for enjoyment of your job, or your ability to skill up and excel at something or learn something new.

Francis Pindar (A2A)  08:24

Yeah, I think it’s also we kind of talked about in some of the other sessions was around like constraints in the process. And actually, you can have just one thing, one constraint in that DevOps process, which even if you optimize everything before or everything after, it’s utterly pointless, because everything’s feeding through on the same track, and it’s all everything’s gonna hit by the same constraint, and you’re still going to be limited by this. And it’s a kind of a way of kind of, and that if that’s a person, an individual, just, you know, the pressure on them to get that word, seeing all this work, building up not being able to do it or responsible just for doing that packaging, and knowing it’s a complete pain, you know, is the mindfulness and the whole mental side. Yeah,

Jack McCardy  09:07

I think if you use like a real world example, I think an area that you see that most often like as a bottleneck, it’s something maybe like QA or testing, especially for quality assurance team is separate to the Salesforce team. And this is one of those things that when we talk about best practice, DevOps is not necessarily about the tools and technology, you can have the best tools and technology in the world. But ultimately, it comes down to people and how you manage people and that process of thinking about that, then, you know, your QA team, for example, don’t sit outside to Salesforce, bring those people that responsible into the team into the communications into the channels that they need to be in so that the whole team can be successful. And those bottlenecks don’t happen. The silos aren’t there. And that’s actually the probably the biggest challenge that we’re looking to solve, you know, for anybody that’s listening that’s slightly more well versed in DevOps or even does some of it themselves. You know, there’s tons of documentation or suggestions out there on version control branching strategies, or do you have

Francis Pindar (A2A)  10:03

branching at all? Is it trunk only? Is Bardsey versus Yeah.

Jack McCardy  10:08

Right. So all of that information is out there. So and still we see the required cultural shift being neglected as might be a strong word, but not as well considered or seen as less important. Yeah, showing the value of it. Yeah, exactly.

Francis Pindar (A2A)  10:22

And I think when we talk about backup in one of those zooms, and actually, for me, actually backup is a big cop can be a big cost saver as well. And so I’ve kind of used backups as well as a way of removing full sandboxes. Because I’ve got an environment that can could go into a partial backup, but obviously, limitations with that is only like 10,000 records per object. So it’s a pain in the ass to use. But the backup can restore to the maximum size of the partial sandbox. So actually, I could get rid of one of my full sandboxes, make a saving on that, get a backup, which cost less than that full backup full sandbox, and then see partial sandbox with backup data. So you’re testing the backup by seeding it in the first place by being able to restore to it and saving money on a full back full sandbox as well,

Jack McCardy  11:16

for sure that if we come back to one of the things that we’ve talked about is, you know, people’s mental health, I guess just having backup gives you that, you know, aside from what it’ll do for you, you know, your time to recover is one of the doora metrics, right? So if something does go wrong, how fast can you do that? And that absolutely is and we see it as part of your DevOps process, because that’s the team that’s going to be responsible for fixing it when it hits the fan. And it all looks bad on you ran that team. And they are exactly so we’ve actually started to see a little bit more of a shift or when we’re speaking to Salesforce teams, pulling back up out of IT ops or another team in the business and handing that responsibility back to the Salesforce team, which is great, because that Salesforce team needs to know what’s going on. And they need to know how to fix it. And they can’t just be given a chance give you

Francis Pindar (A2A)  12:05

abilities in other ways. So like one of the projects I’m working on at most got a lot of record based on thick, and actually just creating new sandboxes is just a pain because you’re essentially doing data migrations, to move conflict through. And also just creating a new sandbox is just a bit of a hassle. So actually, the backups great for that. It’s just, I’m just gonna restore those tables, for sure. Well, job done.

Jack McCardy  12:29

You make it sound like a click of a button.

Francis Pindar (A2A)  12:32

Yeah, well, I said, Yeah, it does kind of help you for certain things like that as well, which I found quite useful. So

Jack McCardy  12:38

yeah, for sure. For sure. It’s such an interesting space. And I think I think that shift in that understanding is definitely getting there. I think it’s interesting when we’re talking about backup most people or there’s a lot of people that would be like I use Version Control, I have a backup. And yeah, you do. But it’s a mess. It is a kind of, and you might not even have it all in there, which is also often the case.

Francis Pindar (A2A)  12:59

Go back to that. Profiles. Yeah, exactly. And I think if it is, it’s like, it’s a big topic. It’s a huge deal. And I think it’s also it’s quite hard, I always find it, it’s quite a hard sell initially, unless you’ve got the metrics and stuff to back it up to go, Hey, look, this is taking this amount of time it could be taking this if we just did you know, the so if somebody’s going into the what how do you see is that kind of like that progression? Through DevOps? Yeah. So

Jack McCardy  13:27

just to touch on metrics? Again, I think that’s one of the things that when we’re speaking to Salesforce teams, and, you know, how do you currently measure your success? Either they don’t, or they go, how stressed I am on a Friday, right? You know, there was a kind of the options. And I think that can be a real hindrance to them going to leadership, for example, and saying, hey, I want to buy this tool, or I want to do this, that or the other, and it’s probably going to take x amount of effort, and they go, what’s the return gonna be? And they go, I don’t know. So it’s metrics is something really important to consider, I think we see a lot more teams using the Dora metrics now, which is great. So that so looking at those things is absolutely a way that you can see your maturity rising. So there’s kind of two schools of thought on maturity, you can see that as the amount of the amount of tooling or the amount or the different types of things that you’re doing within your process. How much is automated or not automated, as this case may be, but if you look at a process, you can still have a manual process and maybe using a tool like gearset or, you know, one of the other DevOps platforms out there is we could automate it for you, but you’re still saving time by even still doing it manually, you know, so your maturity is rising, you know, is the level of effort to automate things going to be worth it? If you’re what’s the, there’s a bit of a balance,

Francis Pindar (A2A)  14:49

they kind of always come back to that constraints thing of actually, you could do it but if you’ve got another place that’s got a bigger constraint, then how’s it gonna help you?

Jack McCardy  14:56

That’s right. And I think a lot of the improvements that a lot of folks see when they first start down this road is once they start thinking about their deployments in the first place and getting the deployments but right, that time to value kind of comes down significantly from that one piece. And then it’s just, there’s just about the, I think they then find out, Oh, what if we, it’d be really good if we could do this, or that. And that’s when they will start to head down that path. And I think a lot of one of the pitfalls and common pitfalls that teams or managers can get sucked into is looking at utopia, looking at fully automated processes, and go, I want that, and have that as like the end goal, rather than, you know, appreciating that journey that you’re going on, because it’s like cliche, life is a journey, not a destination kind of thing. And, you know, the same thing can apply in this space.

Francis Pindar (A2A)  15:44

I think that’s the same for even if you look at it, as you know, the Salesforce maturity and stuff like that, you can see this whole utopian goal of chatbots, and all that other stuff. But actually, the end of it is progress, you are going on this journey, and you’ll find value in different things as you’re going through. And your worldview always changes as you’re doing it, you know, as you’re learning more,

Jack McCardy  16:03

for sure. I think DevOps is one of those things that it’s not you do this, and that’s the way you do it, it’s evolves and it changes. We do this right now. But always be looking ahead to say what’s our next thing is the way that we’re doing things now the right way, you know, always having kind of a bit of like a VA mindset, I guess about it, you know, it’s things fit for purposes, this requirement, what we needed to do, you know, always be thinking about, you know, what the next thing is for you and you as a team, and that in your DevOps process might mean, as we talked about version control, switching to a different git branching model, yes, things that you have a DevOps process set up, and it’s good, let’s assess what we need in the future.

Francis Pindar (A2A)  16:41

So even that could involve like, working with a company now that they’re getting a whole new team set up to support service cloud, for example. And if I, that could totally change the branching strategy of what you’re gonna go in. So it could

Jack McCardy  16:53

mentally new teams, I think there’s almost this notion that a couple of people are responsible for DevOps, you know, they look after the deployments or the tooling. And, and that’s kind of it, that’s their job. But introducing a new team and all members of your team, you know, it’s getting everybody bought into that, and understanding the part that they play and putting out actually putting responsibility in their hands to get their changes to the place that it needs to be for either the process to kick off or be responsible for that throughout delivery process will, it’s you know, it’s not just chucking work over the wall.

Francis Pindar (A2A)  17:23

Yeah. And that kind of understanding the, one of the things I presented earlier on was the whole, the mindset shift of what it is and people thinking, Oh, my God, you’re automating everything, oh, I’m out of a job. But it’s really not. It’s changing in the way you work. But then it’s more interesting. You’re not just doing the same thing again, and again, you’re actually working on the process and, and building it out and improving it and streamlining it. And there’s a great book that I love, called the Phoenix Project in its early I did Yeah. And it’s brilliant. It’s basically a storybook, essentially. Have you read it,

Jack McCardy  17:58

I haven’t read it. I am inspired, though. Yeah, it’s a

Francis Pindar (A2A)  18:01

cool, but it is basically a storybook on a company that is literally on its knees, I think I think literally first couple of slides saying their share prices crashed and the CEOs left or where all this kind of stuff going on. And the first 100 pages is just problem. And then it kind of shifts, and they start adopting agile and DevOps practices to really change the business around. And what I love about the book is you can spot the characters, the characters and books that are Yeah, that’s Jeff at work. And you could just see them everywhere. It really probably because it’s a story, but it’s very accessible people. So when I’m starting a new kind of DevOps journey, I start working on your company or not, there’s using using agile in a fragile way or whatever, you know, this is the book I get out and give to people because it is very accessible. And it’s just gives you an idea of the whole picture. I suppose.

Jack McCardy  18:57

The interesting thing about that mindset shift is I mentioned this in my talk earlier was those mindset shifts, and those cultural changes or routes, like role changes are can be a little fractious to begin with. And I think there’s a lot of notion these days that we shouldn’t be like, we want to please like our staff, you know, the we were speaking about it earlier, like speaking about it earlier, you know, the the talent is still scarce, it’s it’s in high demand, and there’s that, oh, we don’t want to change things because you know, they are bad, but it works. So maybe

Francis Pindar (A2A)  19:25

you know, they haven’t left. Yeah,

Jack McCardy  19:29

exactly. Right. And we don’t want to spoil the applecart. And you know, I think that’s again mentioned earlier, when it comes down to communication and say, Look, we understand this might be changes that you weren’t expecting, or might not wholly agree with, but want to buy into this vision that this is about all of us that if this is about giving you your time back, it’s not giving you some some happiness at work. And I think having that as an organization, if you have that level of maturity to look at yourselves like that and make a change and say yeah, we know this could cause this Using the short term, but the long term benefits are worth it. I think that’s a real way that you can set yourself up for success at the start of the process. If an employee leaves


right for the new world,

Jack McCardy  20:11

right, perfect.

Francis Pindar (A2A)  20:12

So yeah, that’s fascinate. Yeah, no, thanks so much. It’s been really fascinating. And yeah, I’ve learned a lot. DevOps has been quite good. Because I only really, from an architectural point of view, you’re kind of like, looking at it at this kind of high level. And actually, it’s been quite interesting just knowing how even just I’ve never even thought of the kind of the impact it has on people’s productivity and happiness side of things. I’ve always thought it’s just it’s a two lane problem that so it’s, you know, the both has been quite fascinating for me as

Jack McCardy  20:42

well. I’m glad picked up. Thanks for coming and, and inviting me on really appreciate it. Yeah. Cool. Thanks so much. Thank you.

Francis Pindar (A2A)  20:49

Thanks for watching, or listening to the Salesforce posse podcast now, please, please, please, if you like, or what you see or hear then please rate this podcast in your podcast player, as it tells me that there are people out there that actually are listening to this and that it’s useful to them. Also, it helps the podcast algorithms to kind of elevate the podcast in the different podcast directories which will be really helpful for me, as well. And finally, if you do have a question that you want to ask on the podcast, then head to Salesforce And maybe you will appear in the next podcast, but apart from that, thanks for listening, and until next time, Ta ta.

In this episode of the Salesforce Posse podcast, we invited Quratulain Tariq; co-founder of PakDreamin’, a Salesforce Certified Sr. App Engineer at Ortoo to today’s episode we share her fascinating journey with the Salesforce community. Quratulain graduated in 2017 as a software engineer in Pakistan and expected to go into another quality assurance, but in the end, became employed by the UK company Ortoo. Then after searching for the term ‘salesforce.’ She then realised that there’s a whole community out there on Salesforce, and by joining London’s Calling DemoJam live streaming picked up the Salesforce bug and got hooked. Then she got into Trailhead and started creating her own Trailhead internal community at work.

Quratulain became a salesforce MVP; an award given by Salesforce to people with expert Salesforce knowledge who share their experiences to help others achieve in Salesforce. In addition, she collaborated in starting the Pakistan Dreamin’ event, where they had 700 – 1000 registrants, which was a great platform for Pakistani people to connect with trailblazers and different companies and countries and really did put the Pakistan Salesforce community on the global map. Pakistan Dreamin’ happened in August this year.

During today’s conversation, we dive into how Quratulain learned about Salesforce and what kind of value people can get from joining a community. Then, Quratulain shares how she became a Salesforce MVP. In addition to that, we explore Pakistan Dreaming, what it is, what opportunities it gives people, how it opens doors to another level of Salesforce for people, and more. At the end of the conversation, Quratulain shares a piece of lifelong advice to people hoping to make a career in Salesforce by saying, be yourself, don’t beat yourself too much over something, and you will get there eventually, whatever your goal is.

At Salesforce Posse, we interview influencers in the Salesforce ecosystem so that we can gain a better understanding of how to excel in a career path from a Salesforce Admin or Developer to an Architect.

[01.45] Learning about Salesforce – Quratulain walks us through how she got into Salesforce and how she found out there’s a whole salesforce community out there.

[04.21] The value of community  – The joy of having a community that has your back in times of need and the acceptance of anyone without concern where they come from as the value of having a community, says Quratulain.

[11.45] Becoming Salesforce MVP – Quratulain shares the moment when she became a salesforce MVP and how she processed becoming an MVP.

[15.35] Dreaming events – Quratulain dives into how dreaming events are organized in the US and around the world and what value those events have for those communities.

[17.48] Pakistan dreaming – First community-led conference within the salesforce ecosystem in Pakistan.

[24.26] Advice for people starting in Salesforce – Stop comparing and bringing value to your community in what way you can as the advice that she gives to her younger self, says Quratulain.


Connect with Quratulain

LinkedIn –

Twitter –


Resources Mentioned in the Podcast

Indeed Jobs:


Salesforce Community Conferences:

Salesforce Community Events:
This episode’s a little different from the regular podcast because it is a session I hosted at London’s Calling. London’s Calling is a Salesforce community in-person event that I run every year where we bring Salesforce gurus and influences from across the ecosystem. The aim of the event is for all of us to better understand best practices on the Salesforce platform and to help build long-lasting relationships with Salesforce experts across the world that have helped so much in my career. So this session is a panel discussion on the future of Salesforce careers, the current demands, and tips and tricks in the ecosystem. We have Stuart Mills, VP of Trailhead & Ecosystem in EMEA, working at Salesforce. Vikky Moritz-Henry, a Salesforce Consultant and freelance Salesforce trainer from France and Martin Brown, a newly minted Salesforce Administrator, is talking about what he learned while getting his first job, as well as myself.
So if you are interested in growing your Salesforce career and understanding some tips and tricks and stats on the current Salesforce talent economy, then you will find some value in this conversation with Stuart, Vikki, Martin and myself.
At Salesforce Posse, we interview influencers in the Salesforce ecosystem so that we can gain a better understanding of how to excel in a career path from a Salesforce Admin or Developer to an Architect.

Contact the Panel:

Stuart Mills: Twitter, LinkedIn
Francis Pindar:
Twitter, LinkedIn
Vikky Moritz-Henry: Twitter,
Martin Brown:

This episode’s guest is Johann Furmann from Berlin. What I love about his Salesforce Story is that he started as an Accidental Salesforce Admin and is now a Certified Technical Architect and has only relatively recently started learning to code on the platform in depth. He is living proof that you don’t have to be a really incredible coder on the platform to become a Certified Architect. He works with clients across the world to help support and architect their salesforce implementations following industry standards and best practices and also now builds apps on the Salesforce platform to help Salesforce admins at

At Salesforce Posse, we interview influencers in the Salesforce ecosystem so that we can gain a better understanding of how to excel in a career path from a Salesforce Admin or Developer to an Architect.

Johann is one of a growing number of people that are freelancing and carving out a niche for themselves and working for clients across the globe. We talked about if Admins are Architects, Developing on the salesforce platform, and how he sees his role as an architect.

Contact Johann: Twitter, LinkedIn

Sponsored by Salesforce Architect Training